Tumbleweed Holiday Sale

30 thoughts on “Tumbleweed Holiday Sale”

1. God, yet another Shafer/Tumbleweed promo… People actually PAID $997 for a planset for a tiny trailer? One born everyday I reckon. Give it a rest.

2. According to Jay Shafer, he’s put in countless hours of work into each of his house plans so that partly explains the higher than normal cost.

   Like many people, I never understood his pricing system. Reducing the original price of this plan by 90% is either a confirmation of my belief or its an act of desperation for his business.

   • Is Mr. Shafer unable to count? That would explain his “countless hours” claim. Otherwise, sounds like a bunch of nonsense. $979 for plans? That sounds like a good racket if you can get into it.

     • I don’t think Mr. Shafer believe its nonsense. I suspect that he considers himself a serious “Artist” and that he should be compensated for his craft since he labored away his blood, sweat and tears into each design for the benefit of (fill in the blank).

       I applaud his effort and his designs but if he’s asking me to fork over that much for his “art”, I’ll just opt for a cheaper alternative like Google SketchUp instead.

       • Not everyone has the construction knowledge or the computer knowledge to draw up a decent set of plans themselves. And these are good sets of plans, not just a floorplan and a couple elevations as some of the other folk in doing tiny houses here are peddling. This idea that one can sit down and fool around with some software from google and get a set of plans similar to what you’re buying here is… funny.

         Shafer’s plans are detailed, the larger ones built on foundations are fully to code, and even the smaller ones have enough details that a house built according to them would be to code… if code allowed houses this size.

         Comparing these to some fanciful drawings knocked together over a week by some guy with no actual architectural training or construction background is ludicrous.

         As for the original cost of the plans, good luck getting a good set of plans from even one of the big mass production places for less than a few grand. His rates are totally in line with the rest of the industry.

         • If aspiring Tiny House builders lack the requisite computer or architectural knowledge to produce a plan on their own, perhaps they should weigh all the alternatives, yeah?

           Michael Janzen offers plans for a drop in bucket.

           If you want traditional “stock plans”, try Sheldon Designs.

           If you’re willing to drop a $1,000 for a plan, why not spend it on a seasoned pro like Ross Chapin?

           Ryo built a shell without any prior building experience for less than what Shafer’s plans normally cost, simply by using Google SketchUp and relying on tips from sites such as this one.

           There’s a reason why Geek Squad charges close to $300 for a simple computer reload. They prey on their customer’s ignorance.

         • Chapin’s smallest plans will set you back just about the same. Sure, his smallest and Schafer’s smallest aren’t the same size, but the size isn’t really the primary cost of putting plans together. Just like with our home’s material costs, extra wall length and square footage is cheap. The detailing where the costs lie, and the detailing of a 100 sq foot home isn’t all that different from a 500 sq foot home.

           Moreover, Chapin sells a heck of lot more plans than Schafer does I bet, which tends to make things cheaper.

           In short, I don’t see anything out of line about Schafer’s pricing. It seems to be roughly in line with what you’d get from anyone selling these sort of *fully ready* plans. And once again, a couple elevations and a floor plan is not a full plan. You hand that to a builder, and they’re gonna laugh, then tell you to get them the rest or pay them to put the rest together for them.

         • I hear what you’re saying.

           For $100, Shafer’s plans make sense. For $1,000, there’s a psychological barrier I can’t seem to over come.

           For $1,000, I would rather spend the money on Ross Chapin’s plans than Shafer’s plans. It’s just a matter of personal preference and consumer choice based on market analysis.

           The one major assumption you’re making is that Shafer’s competitors don’t a) comply with international building codes and b) include more details aside from elevation views. This is not the case with every company selling plans.

           The great thing about the market is that there’s something for everyone.

           I could afford to buy anything Shafer sells but I would rather focus on the more “grass roots” aspect of the movement like what Peter King, Lamar of Solar Homes, Michael Janzen and Ryo are doing.

         • They’re all good folks, King especially. But their plans are not what you get when you buy a set of professionally prepared plans like those offered by both Chapin and Schafer. And yes, part of the difference is in code adherence, and part of it is in the amount of detail included, and part of it is simply that they’re prepared the same way building plans are prepared all over the country. It’s what builders expect, what the local code officials expect, what inspectors expect, what that plumber or electrician you might hire to do some of that sort of work expects.

           Like I said before, you can hand a set of plans from Chapin or Schafer to a builder, and they’ll build you a house. You hand a set of those other plans to the same guy, and you’re gonna get laughed at. They may be fine for someone building a little place in the backyard or out in the boonies themselves, but the amount of work and detailing and knowledge put into the plans isn’t the same, and the pricing shows that.

           You simply shouldn’t expect Schafer’s plans to be as cheap as their’s, size similarities of the finished houses aside, the plans themselves are simply not comparable, and that’s what you’re buying from these guys. Not a finished house, but finished plans.

   • I would also add that FreeGreen.com offers FREE PLANS if you’re interested.

     Some of drawings are just stunning!

3. $979 Eh…I spent just over that for all the materials to build my storage shed! at 12 x 8 it also about 40% bigger!…If I had planed to use it as a Home it might have cost twice that…for insulation windows etc…but to drop that kind of green for…pieces of paper…forget it.

   Its just a fancy box on wheels.

4. I love the passion that Jay has for this lifestyle and his business, but I have to agree that $1000 for plans to a home that would cost well under $25K to build sounds a bit steep. You can accomplish a lot with Chief Architect’s software (including a complete materials list, 3D renderings, etc).

   That said, at reasonable rates, I think supporting an industry leader like Jay is a good thing to do. I’m sure there is a lot of value in the experience that undoubtedly goes into making those plans.

5. While I agree with most of you that $997 is expensive for plans I would have you ponder this;

   1. If you’ve ever purchased “ART,” $1000 is not considered expensive for a painting.
   2. Do you really think your vehicle is worth 20K-30K give me a freaking break.

   All things considered I would say that Jay’s plans are priced right where they should be considering his target market. Does that mean I can afford them, no. I do however, think Jay puts more thought, and creativity into his designs than most smaller home companies I’ve seen.

   Cheers

   • 1. The term “art” is subjective and open to interpretation. That said, critics of Mr. Shafer don’t believe its “art” so therefore, it’s not worth $1,000. Unless of course, you consider a shed “art”.

     2. I’m not sure what the value of my vehicle has to do with Mr. Shafer’s pricing.

   • I pondered what you would have people ponder and have come to this conclusion: neither of your two points to ponder are worth pondering as they do not relate to what was being discussed. What does art and the value of a vehicle have, in any way, to do with this?

6. Crikey, calling a little box on wheels, ART? Are you using premium materials (mahogany, figured maple, walnut)? No. You are banging a bunch of nails in Handy Dan sourced wood. Is it rare and resellable for more than you paid after an interval/ Heck no. What is is is a fairly well thought out micro space/shed on wheels for whatever given purpose.

   Visit a building enthusiast site like: http://www.countryplans.com/ (I have no association with them) and view easily scalable shed & house plans for a fraction of the prices of Tumbleweed.

   In the past few years a pretty sizable market in small transportable structures has popped up. Plans run from the laughably high priced to free, many have been showcased here. A disproportionate amount of postings here are about Tumbleweed such as the road shows, Tumbleweed this and that, blah, blah, blah…

   Bully for Jay at making some coin on structures and plans. Truely good on him. But saturation marketing of free websites seems in pretty poor taste. I hope the planset $ isn’t becoming a life support system for an over active ego.

   I get it, he is selling plans. But so are a lot of others, some good, some bad, some for free. Built to residential code? Get real. How many homes have ladders to get into a micro loft and then there is the fact they will never be seen as a residence other than by a hard core few due to the actual livable sq’. Lets move on, give it a rest, stick a fork in it because the idea has been done.

   So many of the designs here on this site show fantastic construction imaginations that are cleverly designed, comfortable, truly long term livable thinking out of the box on wheels that offer salability should someone wish to move on or build again for profit. The box on wheels, while certainly having merits, not so much…

   Be safe all and have a great Thanksgiving

7. I respect Jay and I respect his work, so this is no direct slam to his plans or what he receives in compensation for them.
   However, I do take issue with the assumption that one cannot draw up a set up plans from a computer program and have a perfectly suitable code conforming small house – especially with some construction background. I know, we’ve done it twice. First with our 480-square foot house and then with my 320 square foot, full basement included, office. My aunt did the plans using a computer program and both builders constructed them suited to fit our county’s building, electrical and plumbing codes.
   Our spread appears in the most recent edition of Mother Earth News, so I think that’s a testament to not only our design tactics, but builders as well.

   • Lot of DIY types doing this work, not nearly so many with actual construction experience. The knowledge of how things are done from the top to the bottom of a house, and how to read a set of building plans gives you the knowledge needed to actually draw your own up. Most of the people here don’t have that sort of background, which is why they’re purchasing plans in the first place.

8. One more point to make – if I handed a builder any set of plans and he laughed in my face, I would be finding another builder. I want a builder who is a visionary, who can take even the skimpiest of plans and build my dream. While we had a computer program for the inside of my office, I only described to our builder what I wanted the outside to look like – he sketched it himself and worked from those.

   • Pointing to a set of plans costing $5 and another set costing $1000, and acting as if they’re the same quality, posses the same sort of style, and are just as complete as the other is a bit crazy.

     Those of you who aren’t able to see the difference between them are probably never going to get it. Suffice it to say though, not every plan is equally well done.

   • Not to be too terribly rude or flippant, but didn’t your contractor accidentally build your house facing backwards so you weren’t able to enjoy the lake view from the porch? And then offer to charge you to turn the house around the correct way?

     That’s the sort of thing a proper set of plans and a builder concerned about such things prevents.

     • Would it be wrong to say that your reply had me laughing uncontrollably?

       • We’re able to laugh about it now too, Michael. The direction of our house actually serves us quite well now that we’re living here full time.
         The one thing I would suggest for anyone is to not try to build any house from 300 miles away.

       • As for plans dictating which way the house is facing, I’ve never saw that, in a $1,000 set of plans, or a $5 set.
         I don’t know why these discussions always have to turn to personal attacks, I posted that I respect Jay’s work and take no issue with what he is charging for his work. He has a right to be compensated fairly for his talents and time, as any of us.
         I only wanted to point out our experience, which allowed us to have a stable, very well constructed house with a set of plans we drew up. Was it perfect? No. Were there problems? Yes, and I’ve been honest about those in an attempt to help others going through the same process.
         Would a $1,000 set of plans have made the difference in how our house was facing? No. I don’t see how unless the architect drawing them up had been on site.
         I’m glad you both had a good laugh, the best kind of laughs is always at someone else’s expense, eh?
         Peace.

     • The house facing the wrong direction was not the contractor’s fault. The WHOLE story is that we weren’t here to oversee construction on our house, hiring an unqualified project manager (we learned a lesson about hiring friends/family). Our contractor was only doing what the project manager told him. Should he have called us directly when he suspected it was facing the wrong direction? Yes, he should have, but again, we told him the project manager was in charge. In an attempt to keep peace with people we care about, we let it go.

9. I run the business side of Tumbleweed Tiny House Company, and I am fascinated by this discussion. One thing it does show is how differently people value the same item.

   Jay and I were aware that for some people $995 is simply too expensive for a set of plans. In response to that, we decided to offer the XS-House plans for $99. As this discussion seems to prove, anything other than free is too expensive for the true bargain hunter. I understand that and appreciate that as well. Jay and I have discussed putting out a free set of plans as well. But before I get into that, I wanted to talk about why we chose the XS-House.

   Because of its smaller design, the XS-House is built on a single axis trailer, which makes it more accessible to the masses (you can tow it with a car). In addition, the materials to build this house are less expensive than our other homes.

   In my opinion, if someone is going to build this house, than the $99 price shouldn’t be an obstacle. The way I look at it, you’ll be spending about $15,000 – $16,000 in materials plus 3 months to build it.

   And that brings up the question, why not just get the free plans? The easy answer is that you don’t like the design. Beauty counts. If you like Jay’s designs, than spending an extra $99 on top of $16,000 is an easy decision. If you don’t like his designs, than it doesn’t matter what the cost is.

   The discussion changes when the price is $995. I get that. That’s why we are offering the $99 house plan.

   From an economic point of view, being in business can be hard. At the end of the day, we all need to pay for food, water, heat, and shelter. And as a business, we must bring in enough revenue to cover our costs. Selling plans is part of how Jay and I make a living. People who buy our plans help us afford to pay a fair wage (to our employees) with health insurance.

   I think our website may give the impression that we are a huge business, and for some, the price of our plans does make us look like “greedy capitalists”. I know that isn’t true. Jay and I could both be making more money doing something else. We’ve chosen the entrepreneurial path because we love it, and we love what we are doing.

   Ten years ago, Jay took a huge risk. He sold his house, maxed out his credit cards and started Tumbleweed Tiny House Company. Jay isn’t a bad guy. He hasn’t committed any mortgage loan fraud. He never tried to talk anyone into buying a house they couldn’t afford. He never asked for government money in hard economic times. What he has done is spread the message to millions of people that there is an alternative to oversized houses and oversized mortgages.

   Keep in mind that when someone pays $995 for a set of plans, they get a house plan that has already been built. It’s tried and true. The quality of the designs just aren’t the same. If you ever have the opportunity to walk through a Tumbleweed House, you’ll instantly understand why. The attention to detail is amazing.

   As for the free plans, it is something we’ve wanted to do for a while. We simply haven’t been able to afford the time to do it. There is a lot of strategy to designing a good set of house plans. Jay and I discussed that the most important elements that a free set of plans should incorporate. Typically, people who buy the $995 plans have experience building, and I’ve learned that people who are looking at the free plans have much less building knowledge, and less to afford on materials. Our current plans don’t meet those needs. The free plans should include:
   1. A material cost of less than $10,000 including bathroom, insulation, and heat.
   2. Materials that can be found at any hardware store such as Home Depot or Lowes
   3. Be buildable in 3 weeks or less.
   From start to finish, designing a great set of plans to meet those needs will take about 100-150 hours. Just writing about it makes me excited.

   And how much do other plans cost?
   Custom plans by architect (approx) – $10,000
   Not So Big House by Sarah Susanka – $5,000
   Eplans.com – $635 to $1,055
   Ross Chapin – $750 to $950
   Tumbleweed Houses – $99 to $995
   Sonoma Shanty – $27
   Michael Janzen’s plan – FREE

   • Great suggestion! That never even crossed my mind. I’ll let that one spin around in my noodle for a while. I’m already trying to figure out the programing that would require. hmmm…..

     • You may want to do a little investigation on how that went for Radiohead – I seem to recall that it was a debacle. I’m assuming no one else wanted to give it a shot after their experiment, since it hasn’t become the norm.

       • Radiohead didn’t release any numbers, but comScore did. comScore puts tracking softwware on people’s computers. comScore suggests that their clients aren’t fully representative of all web users, and they suggest that people who are likely to download illegally aren’t inclined to participate in their program.

         What comScore did find is that 62% of their users paid nothing, and the average price paid was $2.26. Probably not too good for Radiohead. But I guess that depends on what your expectations are.

         Most of the people who paid nothing probably wouldn’t have bought the album if they had the choice, so I’m not sure Radiohead actually lost anything. Radiohead did win big in marketing. It was a huge news story.

10. Other ideas:

    – Place the entry at the opposite end of the building.
    – Eliminate the loft and decrease the height of the building.
    – Eliminate closets and shelving.

    – Add a slightly elevated daybed or futon couch to the living room.
    – Use pull-out storage boxes under the daybed / couch.
    – Store extra blankets in pillowcases on the daybed / couch.
    – Use a computer notebook for all media.
    – To limit wardrobe, recombine and layer several two-piece outfits.
    – Store one pair of boots, shoes and sneakers.
    – Use a hooded jacket rather than a hat or umbrella.
    – Add a coat hook near the entry.

    – Remove the entire wall between the kitchen and living room.
    – Omit the counter to the left of the sink.
    – Attach a folding cutting board to the right of the sink.
    – Store a portable stovetop when not in use.
    – Stack a set of pans and dry goods under the sink.
    – Store a set of dishes / glasses vertically on two upper, narrow wall shelves.
    – Add mug hooks beneath the lowest shelf.
    – Store utensils in a jar on a deep window sill.

    – Beneath the sink, add sets of curtains to the two open sides.
    – Use small, round, spring-loaded curtain rods – supported by cup hooks.
    – Use shelving and pull-out storage boxes under the sink.

    – Dine with your plate on your lap while sitting on the daybed / couch.
    – Dry dishes on a dish towel.
    – Dry dish towels on hooks under the sink.

    – Add a small under-counter fridge / cooler under the sink, if needed.
    – Add an under-counter combination washer / dryer to the right of the sink, if needed.
    – Store additional kitchen items under the daybed / couch.
    – To create more counter space, cover the sink or washer / dryer with a large cutting board.
    – Use a cutting board as a lap desk, to dine / serve or as an ironing board.

    – A pot, bowl, mug, fork, spoon and large knife may be all that is needed.
    – Try one-pot recipes.
    – Use the pot as a mixing bowl, spoon or mug to measure, fork to whisk, mug as a ladle.
    – Recycle a jar to store food as needed.

    – Waterproof the lower half of the bathroom walls and use a shower curtain.
    – Add a towel shelf over the toilet and add towel hooks.

    – Rather than rely on lighting, add skylights.
    – Use skylights over the kitchen counter, bathroom and couch.
    – Add an arched window to the peak of the house in the living room.
    – Use window curtain toppers and mini blinds, if needed.
    – To reflect light, add a full-length mirror to one of the outer bathroom walls.

    – To save space, use a heater that does not stick out from the wall.

Comments are closed.